ACC Preseason Poll

[mediafreak]

Remember, i'm just a messenger, so if you don't like it, take it elsewhere:

ACC Preseason Poll-List
GREENSBORO, Ga. (AP) – The Atlantic Coast Conference 2003 preseason football poll as voted on by 84 media members attending the ACC Football Kickoff. First-place votes in parentheses. School, Points
1. Florida St. (35) 672
2. North Carolina St. (26) 664
3. Maryland (18) 607
4. Virginia (5) 570
5. Clemson 379
6. North Carolina 269
7. Wake Forest 259
8. Georgia Tech 223
9. Duke 137

[PantherPaul]

Last time you'll see NCSU that highly ranked once Miami and Va Tech come on aboard

[kshead]

Given their ACC schedule, I probably would've voted for State. But there isn't a whole lot of difference between the first 4 this year. That is something I thought I would never say. Especially since MD is one of the four. Those Duffner years were horrid.

[magnus]

That's awful close. FSU with more first place votes, but the difference in points (8) is less than difference of first place votes (9).

[QueenCityHillbilly]

I got to vote in that last year.

[magnus]

what'd you do with it?

[FreakOnA_Leash]

Is it not true that state only has one returning starter on their defense? If so, I think that is way to high of a ranking, Virginia is gonna be tough to beat this year. I would have bumped them up a bit.

[SandMan]

Originally posted by mediafreak
ACC Preseason Poll-List
1. Florida St. (35) 672
2. North Carolina St. (26) 664
3. Maryland (18) 607
4. Virginia (5) 570
5. Clemson 379
6. North Carolina 269
7. Wake Forest 259
8. Georgia Tech 223
9. Duke 137

I'll go with:

1. NCSU
2. Maryland
3. FSU
4. North Carolina
5. Virginia
6. Clemson
7. Georgia Tech
8. Wake
9. Duke

[QueenCityHillbilly]

Originally posted by magnus
what'd you do with it? I don't even remember. I actually did pick Wake higher than everyone else for some reason. ACC and college football is not my specialty. I was just focused in on the free beer, free food, and free golf.

[HighPoint49er]

Originally posted by mediafreak
Remember, i'm just a messenger, so if you don't like it, take it elsewhere:

ACC Preseason Poll-List
GREENSBORO, Ga. (AP) – The Atlantic Coast Conference 2003 preseason football poll as voted on by 84 media members attending the ACC Football Kickoff. First-place votes in parentheses. School, Points
1. Florida St. (35) 672
2. North Carolina St. (26) 664
3. Maryland (18) 607
4. Virginia (5) 570
5. Clemson 379
6. North Carolina 269
7. Wake Forest 259
8. Georgia Tech 223
9. Duke 137
When did Greensboro move to Georgia? Not complaining, it would be the best thing ever to happen for High Point.

[Freakshow]

Not an ACC fan at all. Just a college football fan. I think Virginia is the real deal. As a die-hard Gamecock fan, I think they'll beat us...and win the ACC as well.

1. Virginia
2. FSU
3. NC State
4. Maryland
5. Wake Forest
6. UNC
7. Clemson
8. Georgia Tech
9. Duke

Take it to the bank.

[kshead]

Originally posted by FreakOnA_Leash
Is it not true that state only has one returning starter on their defense? If so, I think that is way to high of a ranking, Virginia is gonna be tough to beat this year. I would have bumped them up a bit.

I remember saying it here at TBR last season that I thought UVA would win the ACC this year. But I'm kinda hedging on that prediction now. I can make a decent case that maybe they overachieved a good bit last year. 2 monster comebacks saved them from losing to both Wake and UNC. They should have lost both of those games.

Statistically, they were awful. Bottom 5th of the country on both sides of the ball. And their schedule does them no favors this year. Maybe a year of improvement will make a big difference for them, but they have struggled with stopping the run for years now.

If they win at USC like Freakshow thinks they will, watch out. Only places they won last year were Duke and Wake.

[Freakshow]

All of the USC boards have the UVA game down as a WIN. No problem. I just don't see why they get no respect. WVU was a GOOD team last year. UVA destroyed them. They are only older now.

NC State and FSU are the only possible losses in the ACC IMO. I say they win 1 of the 2 and win out in the ACC.

[kshead]

Originally posted by Freakshow
All of the USC boards have the UVA game down as a WIN. No problem. I just don't see why they get no respect. WVU was a GOOD team last year. UVA destroyed them. They are only older now.

NC State and FSU are the only possible losses in the ACC IMO. I say they win 1 of the 2 and win out in the ACC.

I have a guess as to why. You guys had - what - 6 turnovers in that game at UVA? Hold on to the ball and you win that game. Also, it appeared that WVU was too busy crying about being left out of the Gator Bowl to show up for the Charlotte game.

No way UVA wins at MD this year. Especially after playing at State the week before. I doubt UVA will have much left in the tank. They crushed MD last year. Revenge sucks.

Hey - I might be wrong. Even though I am a VT grad I kinda like Groh and what they are doing in C'ville. And I still believe what I said before about there not being a sliver of difference between the four teams that got first place votes - although FSU and State probably have better players at the skill positions than MD.

For the most part, I just like to argue/debate football and try to look at all sides. :)

[USC-IPTF]

i think virginia got lucky in a few games last year. but i still think they are good, i just feel like they're in for a little bit of a letdown. of course, i've been wrong before and i'm sure i will be again one day. those top 4 teams can go in any order right now, but i really do think fsu will win the conference again. they return 10 of 11 starters on defense, some very capable wr's, the BEST rb in the acc, and chris rix may not be a heisman candidate but he doesn't have to be for them to win. their front 4 is going to be scary this year.

i like it like this:

1)fsu
2)maryland
3)ncstate
4)uva
5)gtech
6)clemson
7)unc
8)wake
9)duke

[USC-IPTF]

Originally posted by kshead
I have a guess as to why. You guys had - what - 6 turnovers in that game at UVA? Hold on to the ball and you win that game. Also, it appeared that WVU was too busy crying about being left out of the Gator Bowl to show up for the Charlotte game.

actually we had 7. 2 of them were forced, 5 of them were unforced. it was pitiful.

[Shocker]

UNC is definately better than Clemson.

Also, I see Va and NC State fighting it out to see who wins the ACC. FSU is third.

[DaveW]

Originally posted by Shocker
UNC is definately better than Clemson.



wager?

[Trashman1962]

Originally posted by Shocker
UNC is definately better than Clemson.

Not sure your basis for this statement other than if it's just a like for UNC and a dislike for Clemson. The Tigers problem, imho, is summed up in one word.....Toughness. The program used to intimidate by being stronger in the 4th quarter on both sides of the ball. The last couple of years the team has seemingly gone soft. By the 4th quarter they are being blown off the line of scrimmage on both offense and defense. If that is not corrected is could very well be a long season.

However, in terms of player talent and UNC, lets not forget that even a "soft" Clemson team last season defeated UNC 42-12. Charlie Whitehurst will be the clear starter. How good he can be is tough to judge. You can point to his very good overall stats for a Freshman quarterback in the ACC, or you can say his stats are padded against weaker teams and he did not fair so well against stronger opponents. Whitehurst is a smart quarterback, I expect him to be in the upper 1/3 of the ACC in terms of rating. At receiver Ariese Currie, Derrick Hamilton and Kevin Youngblood make a good threesome, with Hamilton one of the most dangerous kick return men in the league. I am not sure of the status of Roscoe Crosby (6-3, 200) or Ty Zimmerman (6-4, 205), but if Crosby returns this season, and Zimmerman has actually become eligible then that group of 5 will be as strong as most any group of receivers in the Country. Crosby, Zimmerman and Curie were all top 10 receivers in the Country when recruited out of High School, and I believe Youngblood was also very highly rated.

The running game needs to improve, but they do have some talent. Yusef Kelly will likely be the starter and he did average 4.2 yards per carry last season on 125 carries. Duane Coleman adds a speed compliment to Kelly's power. Cliff Harwell is a great blocking fullback, and lets not forget Sophomore Ty Hill who gained 105 yards on 14 carries against.........yes, UNC....last season.

The kicking game has to be improved simply because Klopp is no longer punting for the Tigers.

Clemson is a real tough team to evaluate. They could be very good, mediocure, or even lousy depending on many factors. IMHO the Tigers will win 7 or 8 and make a fourth straight bowl appearance at the worst, or win 10 and finish 2nd or 3rd in the Conference at the very best. I don't see them finishing behind UNC though.

My picks for the top 2 would be NC State first, and Florida State second. NC State has it all going for them this season. Heisman candidate quarterback and running back, good receivers, and a good defense. This is their year to make something happen. I see a very exciting college season in the ACC...can't wait to get it started.

[mathmajors]

State's young up the middle, but maybe more talented. Secondary is loaded. Offense will be awesome, I hope.

[DaveW]

if phillip rivers even gets invited to the heisman awards, college football talent is very weak

[chipshot]

Originally posted by DaveW
if phillip rivers even gets invited to the heisman awards, college football talent is very weak

Damn, you hate NCSU don't you. If he plays well enough he deserves it.

[Freakshow]

Clemson...

Great receivers. Oh, Zimmerman is at Savannah State (I believe) and Crosby won't be playing.

Clemson has NO depth on OL and a very small DL. Linebacker is also pretty weak.

Don't know about UNC, but I think Clemson will be lucky with 5 wins.

[DaveW]

I think Clemson will be lucky with 5 wins



and the new coaching search begins

[Trashman1962]

Originally posted by DaveW
I think Clemson will be lucky with 5 wins



and the new coaching search begins

That says a lot for a program when a college football team plays in 3 consecutive bowl games and yet the coach is considered on the hot seat. I imagine programs like UNC would be handing out a long term extension to a coach under those circumstances.

[kshead]

What it says is "Expectations are too high" if the coach gets run off for not winning "enough".

BTW. Totally agree with your assessment about Clemson's toughness. Couldn't believe it last year when I watched them get runover by State on national TV.

[Reznor]

Clemson also has one of the best CBs in the ACC. The question will be the rest of their defense. I'm just excited about how tough the ACC is going to be next year, these middle of the road teams better make hay this year, cause next year will be a different story.

I just like Clemson because they have a cat mascot! :mushy:

[USC-IPTF]

ya clemson is a tough team to figure out. the reason bowden is on the hotseat is that clemson fans have unrealistic expectations. sometimes it's like they hold their current coaches up to the standards danny ford set in the early 80's and carried through the decade. another factor is that bowden came in talking like he was going to bring clemson back to prominence, and in 2000 he even had the tigers at #5 in the country at one point after opening the season 8-0. clemson fans got really pumped up and started thinking they were on the way up, but they've been given a little dose of reality since then.

and yes, they've been to 4 straight bowl games but they lost 3 of them, and the only one they won was the humanitarian bowl in boise idaho against la tech, so that barely counts imo. and last year, they were embarrassed 55-15 againts texas tech in the tangerine and if you saw that game, you know the score doesn't quite reflect how one-sided that game was. it was like clemson didn't even show up.

still, clemson has some good players coming back this year. whitehurst showed promise last year. i think he's gonna have a good year. their o-line is improving slowly but surely. they have some solid wr's. derrick hamilton is a very good wr and is great at returning kicks and punts too. they just have a lot of holes i think...too many to contend for the acc title.

however, unlike a lot of you guys, i think uva, maryland, and nc state are all beatable. i don't think these teams are quite the juggernauts the acc media is making them out to be, at least not yet anyway. if you listen to greg doyle you would think they're all '95 nebraska. i wouldn't be surprised if clemson gets 1 or maybe even 2 of these teams.

[LarryD]

Originally posted by HighPoint49er

When did Greensboro move to Georgia? Not complaining, it would be the best thing ever to happen for High Point.

yep. it was in georgia.

[LarryD]

and fsu has too many "ifs" this year to be the favorite.

i'll admit that a lot of bad seeds are finally off the team, but there's still a talent shortage. and the coaching isn't any better.

[USC-IPTF]

Originally posted by LarryD
and fsu has too many "ifs" this year to be the favorite.

i'll admit that a lot of bad seeds are finally off the team, but there's still a talent shortage. and the coaching isn't any better.

ya fsu doesn have some holes, but that defense is gonna be sick larryd. the front 4 and the linebackers are just ridiculous. pope and boulware both return at linebacker. at d-line, moore, dockett, and emanuel are all studs and the back-ups are just as good as the starters.

offensively, greg jones is the best rb in the acc i believe. that guy is a beast. chris rix is ok, but he doesn't have to be spectacular for fsu to win. the wr's are an unknown kinda i guess but fsu always has capable receivers. i know the thorpe guy is supposed to be really good.

anyway, i just think fsu is the team to beat in the acc. i wouldn't be surprised to see them go through the acc undefeated. i could possibly see them losing to uva since the game is @virginia and right after the miami game so maybe they'll be an emotional letdown or something, but other than that, i don't think fsu will have any problems.

[LarryD]

Originally posted by USC-IPTF


ya fsu doesn have some holes, but that defense is gonna be sick larryd. the front 4 and the linebackers are just ridiculous. pope and boulware both return at linebacker. at d-line, moore, dockett, and emanuel are all studs and the back-ups are just as good as the starters.

offensively, greg jones is the best rb in the acc i believe. that guy is a beast. chris rix is ok, but he doesn't have to be spectacular for fsu to win. the wr's are an unknown kinda i guess but fsu always has capable receivers. i know the thorpe guy is supposed to be really good.

anyway, i just think fsu is the team to beat in the acc. i wouldn't be surprised to see them go through the acc undefeated. i could possibly see them losing to uva since the game is @virginia and right after the miami game so maybe they'll be an emotional letdown or something, but other than that, i don't think fsu will have any problems.

the secondary is awful and so is the front four -- my grandmother with her bad hip could run on it. the linebackers are fast, but they are undersized. pope can hit, but he overpursues. and boulware isn't great against the run. he'll get caught out of position, too. he likes to make big plays.

greg jones is coming off a blown knee late in the season. rix got benched last season. he refuses to listen to the coaches and his teammates think he's a cocky mofo. until he does something on the field, they wont trust him.

the receivers are awful -- worst fsu has ever had, as a group. the best receiver is a converted defensive back.

fsu will lose acc games.

[mathmajors]

I would be surprised if ANYONE went undefeated in the ACC.

[DaveW]

Originally posted by mathmajors
I would be surprised if ANYONE went undefeated in the ACC.

ME TOO

[Trashman1962]

Originally posted by USC-IPTF
however, unlike a lot of you guys, i think uva, maryland, and nc state are all beatable. i don't think these teams are quite the juggernauts the acc media is making them out to be, at least not yet anyway. if you listen to greg doyle you would think they're all '95 nebraska. i wouldn't be surprised if clemson gets 1 or maybe even 2 of these teams.

I agree. This is really going to be a fun season of ACC football. The league is strong through the middle of the conference and a number of schools have an opportunity to be a big surprise. None of the teams are juggernauts and I expect none will be serious National Championship contenders.

That said, anything can happen. I was a sophomore at Clemson in 1981 and that was a hell of a ride. We started the season unranked and then just slowly moved up the polls as teams in front lost. I have to say we were not the best team in the Country, we just had the right circumstances fall into place and when put in the position to win it all by beating Nebraska, the team pulled it off. I would not be at all shocked if the conference champion has 2 conference losses.

As for the lofty expectations at Clemson, you are definitely right, but I am not sure it's a bad thing. Why not set your goals high and shoot for them. Don't overlook dollars though. Imho Tommy Bowden won't really be on the hot seat until seats in Death Valley sit empty on gamedays. Ken Hatfield averaged 8 wins a year and was canned....imo.....because of horrible game attendance. As long as Bowden can keep the seats full, I believe he will remain the head football coach. Most probably disagree with that, but it's how I see it. On a side note, it's interesting that the offense has never been as effective since Rodriguez went to West Virginia.

[Shocker]

I just think UNC is better than Clemson. UNC had one of the toughest schedule in the nation last yr and again will have trouble. I just don't think Clemson is that good. Its my humble opinion and we are talking the middle of the ACC - so really, no big deal.

[Freakshow]

Attendance???? Clemson reports sell outs, but GO to a game. The place is 1/3 empty! Hell, they were selling tickets at BI LO to try to drive in traffic.

[Trashman1962]

Originally posted by Freakshow
Attendance???? Clemson reports sell outs, but GO to a game. The place is 1/3 empty! Hell, they were selling tickets at BI LO to try to drive in traffic.

I have been to many many many games at Death Valley and I will have to respectfully disagree with your characterization. You suggest that the norm in Death Valley would is around 55,000 people. You will see that number at a meaningless game against a weak opponent with a lousy Tiger team.

This season, imho there will be 83,500 + for the Georgia game, Furman and Middle Tnn will not likely be well attended (sad but true - not like my days in the early 1980's); however, an upset win over Georgia will improve attendence for both those games and I would predict 65,000 to 70,000 in the stands. The UVA, UNC and FSU games will imho have near capacity attendance, and if the team has had a bad year and is not in bowl contention then the Duke game might be the worst attended all year, maybe even in your 1/3 empty range.

On a side from that, Clemson remains one of the best teams in the ACC in terms of "in the seat" total attendance in the ACC. In addition the remain one of, if not the best traveling team in the league, especially for bowl games.

[DaveW]

clemson better hope they beat Georgia. Georgia game is crucial with 2 easier games followed by Tech and Maryland. Season could be over before it even gets started good.

[Trashman1962]

Originally posted by DaveW
clemson better hope they beat Georgia. Georgia game is crucial with 2 easier games followed by Tech and Maryland. Season could be over before it even gets started good.

I could not agree more. That game will likely set the tone for the entire season. The good news for Tiger fans is that we won't have Klopp punting this year. Clemson outplayed Georgia last year, and lost the game because of horrible special teams.

[kshead]

Originally posted by Trashman1962
Clemson outplayed Georgia last year, and lost the game because of horrible special teams.

Agreed. Very surprising to me too. Those bastard Dawgs cost me some $$$ and once it looked like they wouldn't cover the 9, I was rooting like hell for Clemson.

If you are going to lose the bet and cost me money, then I will turn on you in a heartbeat. :D

[CFBall]

Bet on NC State this year to get you back into the black!

[Shocker]

Originally posted by DaveW
clemson better hope they beat Georgia. Georgia game is crucial with 2 easier games followed by Tech and Maryland. Season could be over before it even gets started good.

There is NO FUCKING WAY Clemson is going to beat Georgia! NO FUCKIN WAY!!!!!!

[USC-IPTF]

i hope georgia beats the hell outta clemson, but i don't think it's gonna happen. georgia is losing musa smith and all 5 of their starting offensive linemen. i think it'll be a pretty close game. i think georgia is gonna be good but they will be vulnerable early i believe.

the good thing for uga is that they have a very good d-line and whitehurst will be running for his life or on his ass constantly. they also have a great secondary.

i think it'll be relatively low-scoring game determined by turnovers and special teams. i do think georgia will win, but it won't be a cakewalk by any means. georgia has the better overall team speed and athletes but it will be an exciting game.

[Piper]

Georgia lost a lot last year. They got, what, 3 starters returning on O? I heard their linebackers are having some trouble with their gaps. Then they had a bunch of players get suspended.

And I still don't like the whole 2 QB thing the Dogs have.

Clemsons got some big lineman. They got some speed at reciever and in the return game. If it's a close game, that kind of adds up to trouble to me. If they can control Pollack and the rest of that D line, they got a good shot.

I ain't touching this game.

[USC-IPTF]

i don't think we'll see too many long sustained drives by either team. i think it'll be a bunch of 3 and outs and some big plays that break for long scores. the clemson o-line is gonna be bigger but still won't be able to protect whitehurst. it's just not a talented offensive line, especially to be holding off a pass rush like georgia can put on a team.

however i do think if clemson wants they can run yusef kelly for 3 yards and a cloud of dust all day and move the ball but i don't think tommy bowden is that patient. he'll be running wr screens and crap and there will be a lot of clemson punts.

on the georgia side, they have a very good group of wr's...better than clemson's imo. their problem is the same as clemson's, no sure thing at runningback and a raw offensive line. i think uga's o-line will come together and they'll be good, but we're talking about 5 brand new o-linemen on opening day! there are bound to be colossal screw-ups by that o-line early on.

imo to bet money on this game would be crazy. it's gonna be decided by a couple of turnovers and big plays that could go either way.

[USC-IPTF]

on second thought, should georgia really be worried about this?
http://www.thetigernet.com/photos/albums/albun50/Q_DSC_2719.jpg

what's this guy hiding under his shirt?
http://www.thetigernet.com/photos/albums/albun50/Q_DSC_2705.jpg

[kshead]

Originally posted by Piper
I ain't touching this game.

If THE MAN is stupid enough to give me a TD with Clemson based on last year's UGA team, I am going to be damn tempted to get on Clemson. Probably the only way.

[DaveW]

I see a sloppy game being played by both teams

[Piper]

Originally posted by kshead


If THE MAN is stupid enough to give me a TD with Clemson based on last year's UGA team, I am going to be damn tempted to get on Clemson. Probably the only way.

True.

Although, its more like if the betting community is dumb enough to drive the points up that high.

[kshead]

Originally posted by Piper


True.

Although, its more like if the betting community is dumb enough to drive the points up that high.

Yup. I think you are right there. Last year it was 10, came down to 9 and I got torched with UGA - all the while wondering why the fuck it was going down instead of up. Silly me.

This year I figure 3-4 and it will rise. But I'm like you in that it would have to be something I think is too good to be true to jump in. If it doesn't move at all or is closer to a pick em, then I will freely admit that I don't know what the fuck people are thinking and enjoy the game with a brew or 6.

One side note - UGA goes 8-3-2 ATS (or 9-3-1 if you were lucky) last year and I was on UGA in two of those losses (Clemson, Fla - Fuck you Terrence Edwards, you wide open pass dropping in the last minute of the game dickhead. :D). Maybe I should just leave them the fuck alone. :)